Episode 112 - Phil Puleo - Leaders on Leadership
When you step in to become a leader, you will always have to wear the hat of leadership, representing and embodying your organization. Sometimes, this could take a toll on you, leaving you feeling lonely at the top. Sharing his thoughts on the price of leadership that leaders have to pay, Dr. Tracey Jones invites Phil Puleo, the Superintendent of the Christian School Association of Greater Harrisburg. Phil shares his experiences and insights as a leader at the school, where loneliness becomes uncertainty, and how he overcomes that. He also talks about how he stays refreshed and replenished amidst dealing with parents and kids in the most important years of their lives, how he deals with critics, and more.
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Episode 112 - Phil Puleo - Leaders on Leadership
Our guest is Phil Puleo. Phil is the Superintendent of the Christian School Association of Greater Harrisburg. He is a dear friend and he has a passion for quality Christian education that impacts current and future generations. You are going to love reading what Phil has to say about paying the price of leadership.
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My special guest is Phil Puleo. He's a dear friend and brother in Christ. We've done a lot of different things together. We're going to talk about that and he's local. He's from the same area, Harrisburg, Pennsylvania. Phil is the Superintendent of the Christian School Association of Greater Harrisburg. This is a unified private Christian school district that operates Harrisburg Christian School and West Shore Christian Academy. Mr. Puleo has a passion for quality Christian education that impacts current and future generations for Christ. Phil also advocates for Christian education as members of the ACSIPA, and the PA Affiliate of the Council on American Private Education. Phil also serves on the Lancaster Bible College Corporation, and the Messiah College Presidential Advisory Council. He's happily married to his dear wife, Cristen, and has four children. Phil, I'm honored to be speaking with you on our favorite topic.
It's great to be with you, Tracey.
I want to tell our readers that I met Phil when I moved back to the area and my first dog, Mr. Blue, had written a book called True Blue Leadership. It had an artsy picture of a dog on the front and everybody kept saying to me, “Is this a kid's book?” I'm like, “It's not a kid's book but it's leadership principles that are universal. It matters on how you contextualize them.” I took True Blue Leadership, and I made it into From Underdog to Wonder Dog, which was the elementary school version of it.
I had all these illustrations done. Phil invited me to come to what was then known as Harrisburg Christian School and do this with the kids year after year. That's how From Underdog to Wonder Dog got published, Boxcar Indy Goes to Doggy World, and on and on. Phil, you were the one that encouraged me that people would want to watch leadership programs from a dog's perspective and you push it out to everybody else in education. It's been a howling success since then. Thank you.
You're welcome. Those kids loved that day in those days. It’s good stuff.
It's so much fun. It's been quite a few years so I'm sure probably they're getting out and reflecting back thinking, “I wonder what happened to that lady and her dog.” Thanks again for the opportunity. Phil, we are talking about leadership and there are a lot of different perceptions on leadership but my father said that there's a price that you're going to pay if you want to be a true leader. There's a lot of people that say it, but they're not willing to pay the price. He came out with this speech years ago, one of his most famous speeches called The Price of Leadership and he talks about four things that you are going to have to expect and pay if you intend to be called a true leader.
The first one of them is loneliness and we've all heard the phrase, “It's lonely at the top.” It's why few people want to step, carry, and wear the mantle of leadership. Can you share with me and the readers what loneliness means to you as a leader, especially in the field you've been in and crafting the vision? You've been through a lot of changes that since I have known you and maybe a word of exhortation for some leaders that maybe you're in a season of loneliness.
I think of loneliness in leadership in two ways. One, there's a personal aspect to it and there is a professional leadership aspect. The personal aspect is who does the leader go to talk to someone. As leaders, we're always on the stage and the hat of leadership is always on. We represent and embody our organization. Where do we go to? What I have found is I have to be deliberate to find a group of people, I don't need a lot. A couple of people that I can go to. Some can be local, others of them live out of state or out of the region where they will listen and encourage and I know that I'm not alone.
There's a leadership of loneliness as it relates to the profession, the roleless leader. To me, sometimes the leader has the vision and discerns the path that the organization should go. That's not because I came up with it, but after collaboration, reading, and sensing direction. There's a saying, “The leader takes people where they need to go but don't want to go.” Nevermore was that true than when we brought Harrisburg Christian School and West Shore Christian Academy together.
Everyone talks about unity and collaboration, but it's another thing to do it, work hard at it, commit to it, and to sacrifice for it. In the summer of 2016, the Christian School Association of Greater Harrisburg, which was doing business with Harrisburg Christian school, had an opportunity to acquire West Shore Christian Academy from Bible Baptist Church. I wish I could tell you that it was a simple one conversation and everyone said, “Let's do this and move forward.” It wasn't. It was a long, hard 4 to 5-month process of acquisition. I found during that time when you're a leader trying to get a sense that this is the direction we ought to go and people are a little unsure about it, there are a couple of things you have to do.
Number one, you've got to focus on the why. Why on earth would we bring these two schools together? For us, it had to do with three things. Number one, we wanted to elevate the level of academic offerings to our kids. Second, we want to increase the financial sustainability of the schools long after all of us are gone. The third is we want to expand the witness and impact in the community far beyond what one school could do. Over and over again, this is the why, this is what we're doing and almost be able to go, “We can live in some uncertainty knowing that as we travel through that uncertainty, we do so together toward that outcome.”
I've often used this analogy. When the wagon train was heading west, they knew they generally wanted to go from Missouri all the way out to Washington State. The map they had was tenuous. Only a handful of people had traveled previously but here's what they knew. We knew where we wanted to go and we knew we were going to go together. That's incredibly important because it does answer the loneliness question. It's that, “The leader is leading. He or she is sometimes lonely.” If we do the why behind the direction we're going, the mission, the purpose that ultimately drives us through the uncertainty, the change, and the, “Are you sure?” After leaving Egypt, even the Israelites said to Moses, “Weren't we better back there in Egypt?”
It’s bondage.
The obvious question is, “Of course not,” but the uncertainty was so terrifying that it led them to ask that question. It’s the leader that stands in the gap there.
I love that you renamed loneliness to uncertainty. The PhD that I got was a merger. Even though it made perfect sense on paper, change is only welcome from a vending machine. Kids now are like, “What's a vending machine?” I'm like, “It was back in the day.” I love that you said that and it is uncertain. The leader has already seen it. You're the leader because you have seen it. I love that you talk about that it's okay to go through a space of this. It has to because if everybody already saw it, you would already be there. You wouldn't have been the one to come up with this idea because everybody would have seen it years ago, and they already would have been this unified thing. I heard that it’s said as monitor the distress. Gauging the uncertainty and knowing that for a season, you may be out there on your own voice in the wilderness.
Sometimes it feels like winging it.
Price Of Leadership: We can live in some uncertainty, knowing that as we travel through that uncertainty, we do so together toward that outcome.
I can remember, for the readers, that I was in some of those meetings. Everybody goes, “In the beginning, a few will come along and most everybody else.” I've been through stuff where people vehemently fought me on it and tried to sabotage it. In the end, I finally had to cut and say, “You don't want to go where we want to go.” The other thing is, we all have this weird idea of I want to set the vision. When people start setting the vision other than the leader, that's where we’ve got to have frank talks and say, “If you want to do a school like this, you go to a school like this.” That happens a lot in ministry. Everybody's like, “The ministry should be doing this so we're going to start doing this.” The leader, the board, and the founder end up feeling incredibly lonely and I always go to them because you are letting people do stuff and you have to lead it.
One of the first things we did in the first full year together was we had two schools with two different mission statements, two different vision statements, two different sets of core values, lots of similarities but different languages. What we did was a collaborative process with our communities, our faculty, and our board, and combined and created a new mission, vision, and core values so both schools knew, “We may have some slightly different cultures and communities, but we're unified in this process under the same mission.”
That's a great insight. Even with two Christian schools coming together, there are periods of loneliness. I've read books about churches that have split over moving an organ from one side to the other. It's human nature and leaders have to be ready for that. I read this from my dad when I was little, and it didn't scare me. As a matter of fact, it let me know, “When I will encounter it, and every leader does. If you don't, I'm not sure you're leading. Don't be freaked out. It's part of the course.” If you're in it for years and years, there's something else going on that you need to evaluate and make some other changes. I thank you for being transparent with that because I watched that.
That’s great advice your dad gave because we hold leaders in high regard as if they don't feel this. It robs the humaneness of leadership that discourages a young leader or even an experienced leader, “They don't deal with this.” No, maybe they do.
That's loneliness. Thank you for unpacking that for us. The next one is weariness. There's good weary, there's bad weary. There's psychological weary and physical weary. What does weariness mean for you as a leader? My dad always talked about it. When you're doing something worthwhile, don't be surprised because you're always going to have some people do more than their fair share, and others do less. Which is why I've always been obsessed with followership because I'm like, “How do you find the right ones and make sure that you stack the team with the good ones?” What does weariness mean for you, Phil? How do you stay refreshed and replenished? You’re in the academic environment. Especially with all going on, you're dealing with parents and kids in the most important years in their life. How do you do it?
I'll use a sports analogy. Weariness to me is like playing an athletic event. It's all good, exciting, thrilling, and there's going to be an outcome. Are you ever tired? Climbing a mountain, there's this hike you want to go on and you're going to climb it and it's wonderful. The view on the way up, and at the zenith is beautiful, but are you tired? There is a degree to which any good work that you do is going to make you weary and tired. What's critical is to make sure it doesn't, in some regards, weary your heart. There's a scripture that says, “Don't grow weary in doing well.” It's the idea that in the process of doing well, you eat at your inside. You mentioned the employee that doesn't work as hard. As a leader, I have to be careful. I work hard, tirelessly, and probably more than I should at times. I can't put that expectation on a person who maybe, in fact, is balancing their life a little better than me at that particular time.
The other thing I have to do is make sure I love them, guide them, motivate them, and direct them in a way that works for them but ultimately, what is best for the school, and what's best for the students. One of the best things I ever learned about leadership was the idea that it's okay to be different to different people. There is a degree of equity that you want to bring, but people are different. How you interact with them and how you direct them might be slightly different because it meets their particular needs and personality. Weariness is a real issue. In the Christian school movement in the northeast, we've seen a lot of leaders leave. It's a culmination of it's not the lack of passion, the weariness has gone from being a physical thing to wearing on their heart.
Where do you draw your replenishment from? Do you have organizations above you that provide you the support? You're pouring out into others, but who in your situation pours into you?
I've got some friends in the Association of Christian Schools International that encouraged me. I have some people who, technically in the organizational structure are below me, but are a great encouragement to me. I have a dear wife who encourages me. My kids make me laugh. I find encouragement in my church community, in my quiet time, and times of reflection but I’ve got to work at it. Weariness is always looming. If I'm not conscious of it, that cloud can descend easily.
We're still flesh and blood and we need to take time to go back to the well and replenish, otherwise burnout. Thank you, Phil, for sharing that about weariness. Talk to me. You said you had a quote about critics. I want to know what that is.
If you're in leadership, not even long enough, you will have people who criticize. I often have said, “If it's not perfect, it's not good.” It's hard to be perfect. There's a great Christian song out, Perfection is My Enemy. That's someone trying to be perfect. Sometimes as leaders, we think we have to be perfect. Some of that is it's the critics that you get, the email, the snide remark, the upset parent or student. There's a great quote and I have it on my wall. It's by Teddy Roosevelt, who I used to tell students was a tough guy. He was so tough that he got shot once in the chest and decided to take his speech out of his pocket, which ended up saving his life because the bullet had gone through the speech and not through his chest. He ends up reading the speech, delivering it, and going to the hospital.
He said this about critics, “It’s not the critic who counts, not the man who points out how the strong man has stumbled, or where the doer of deeds could have done it better. The credit belongs to the man or woman who is in the arena, whose face is marred by dust, sweat, and blood. Who strives to do deeds, who strives valiantly, who errs, who comes short again and again. Because there is no effort without error and shortcoming but who does strive to do the deeds. Who knows the great enthusiasms, the great devotions, who spends himself in a worthy cause, who at best knows, in the end, the triumph of high achievement. Who at the worst if he or she fails, at least fails while daring greatly so his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who know neither victory nor defeat.” Any reason why you would wonder why I put that on my wall?
No. I love it.
I keep that close to me.
That's good because there's certain for some of this stuff. For our leaders out there, you do get better at it. My dad always said, “You get a softer heart and a thicker skin.” You hear it but it's par for the course. You look at people in politics and you're like, “How can somebody do that?” You have to have a unique coating or a special hide to do that stuff too.
For me, in your dad's quote, the softer heart comes more naturally. I love people. I want to serve them. I'll do whatever I can to help and to bless people and encourage them. The hard part is this thicker skin. It's personal. In some regards, because the heart is soft, the skin softens a little. That's an area that doesn't come naturally for me.
There's a great book called Unoffendable by Brant Hansen. He's a wonderful Christian author and that changed my life because I was always like, “I'm a task. I'm a justice person,” so I'm always like, “Righteous indignation.” He’s like, “You can't see people's motives. You have no right to be judgmental towards them.” We have to judge sin but I don't know what's going on with somebody. Save yourself a lot of heartaches and not get all bent out of shape out of this stuff. Sure, you can have a discussion with them but it helped me orient myself and go, “Only God knows why that person said that.” It was the spirit of conviction. I read that probably at least once a year because that's something that I have to do because I'm quick. The tongue can destroy.
Price Of Leadership: It's okay to be different to different people. There is a degree of equity that you want to bring, but people are different.
That's a good word.
We did loneliness and weariness. How about abandonment? Abandonment is a scary word. My dad was honing in on abandoning what we like and what to think about in favor of what we ought and need to think about. I look at it as a focus type of thing. Can you tell me what you've had to abandon as a leader and what you encourage other leaders and some of the abandonment stuff they're going to have to deal with?
I started off as a teacher and moved into administration and now the superintendency. The more you move up, you move farther away from students. I have told people it’s the greatest thing I've had to use your word and your dad's word abandonment. The greatest thing I had to give up is the amount of time I have direct interaction with students. My first love is the development of Christian leaders and helping young people realize that leadership is about influence, which means we can all be leaders and we all need to develop that leadership skill in some form or fashion. In that regard, to me in the educational field, that's the great abandonment, which seems ironic because I lead an educational organization yet it separates me from our main focuses, the kids.
What helps me as a leader now in more of an administrative executive realm is asking myself a couple of questions. Am I staying focused on what matters the most? Of all the things I have to do, all the hats I wear, it’s asking myself what matters the most today, this week, this month, or this year. The other thing I asked myself is, is there someone else that can and should do it, or is this something only I can do? When I say only I can do it, you can get anyone to walk in, sit in this chair and do it. In the organization, as it is currently structured, is there anyone else who's doing this task?
If the answer is no and it's in the realm of what I do, I have to focus. If it's something that can be delegated out, I have to do that in light of being focused on the tasks. This area can be a struggle for me. I joke with one of our faculty members that I'm an ADD administrator. Rabbit? Squirrel? What? Where? To me, it's a constant working toward and stepping back, assessing, prioritizing, making lists, and working hard at it.
That’s absolutely beautiful and I love that about delegation. Another good book for that is Michael Gerber’s The E-Myth Revisited and he talks about that. Any time we're entrepreneurs, we're managers, and we're technicians but you shouldn't have to do everything in the organization. When the early church was growing, they had to delegate and that's why it continued to grow. You’ve got to abandon that.
I love that you talked about the students because that's kind of in the military. I worked on jets and you have to go to the Pentagon and do a staff role and I'm like, “I don't want to do that.” That's where I made the decision that I want to do something else because I’m in the fray where the rubber meets the road thing. I'm glad you stuck around though and now a little bit farther removed, but I see how the kids relate to you so I still know that you still get your fix from that.
I often say it's my first love. Interacting with the kids and teaching some leadership development classes to them is my first love.
You stuck with it, even though you're serving them in a different way. You're a little bit more distant from them but as far as the chain of command, you're still right there. That's good for people to know. As they climb the ladder, they're going to have to abandon some of the things they may like to do a lot and pick up on the ones. The last one, Phil, is vision. Dad always talked about vision as seeing what needs to be done and doing it. I always used to laugh at that. I’m like, “It's not some dove landing on your head and saying, ‘This is what you do.’” Maybe it is. Can you talk to me about the vision? You had the vision of combining these two entities together for economies and for other reasons. What's next for your vision? How did you even bring the kids back to school? How do you get clarity?
You've covered a couple of things. There was no dove on my head and burning bush, but there was this sense in me long before I even moved to Harrisburg that the unification, the joint effort and the collaboration of Christian schools is a better approach than trying to do it on our own. It's hard. One of the great things of leadership and when you're a person who has faith, there's a journey that only you as the leader can walk on and through. It's hard sometimes to fully explain it but there was a sense that we have to bring these schools together.
It was birthed in Maryland when I was down there and there were two Christian schools that were not far apart but wouldn't play sports together. I came to Harrisburg, and there were five Christian high schools within 10 miles of each other. They're all struggling financially and all trying to do best by kids yet there's inefficiency. There was always this sense, this vision of promoting collaboration and to see the opportunity. The Lord blessed it and the people to come together and rally behind it. I'm a vision guy. I'm a firm believer in the proverb that says, “Where there is no vision, people perish.” While this is not true for all of it, the opposite is true. Where there is vision, people prosper. That's true organizationally and personally. Leaders are having a personal vision and a professional vision. I will tell you, the ultimate vision of bringing the schools together I find in Psalm 78. It says this, “Teach the praiseworthy deeds of the Lord.”
It talks about five generations, the ancestors, the parents, the children, the unborn, and the unborn of the unborn. It concludes this, “Teach the praiseworthy deeds of the Lord, do it for five generations and they will place their trust in God.” When I think about bringing these schools together, the hard work, the effort, the sacrifice that many people have made, and we are far from done. It's like saying after being married three years, “I've got this marriage thing down.” Not exactly.
As we work through it, it's not only for the kids now, but the kids who aren't even born yet that will need a Christian education. That's what we're about. I told a kindergarten teacher once, and usually a boy and squirrely are the same thing, “That squirrely little boy who can’t stay settled in their seat, if the Lord were to tarry, that is someone's great grandfather.” That's mind-blowing. We are impacting a generation that we won't be alive to see. To me, that vision of what Christian education is, that's what the vision of the Christian School Association is. That should be every leader’s vision, “I'm going to make an impact not only in this generation, but I'm going to leave something for the generation to come.”
You did define vision and your vision. I love that you said, “The sense in me.” When you get that calling, you probably had it early on and it’s like an orchestra or a refrain that keeps coming back in and out of your life at different times. I was reading a book on teaching the Jesus way and it said, “For Christian teachers, pick your mission or passion that heaven will cheer.” I know when you talk about leading on for an eternal legacy that haven't yet set because that's what we're supposed to do if we call ourselves Christians. Is it any wonder to our readers why you are completely in your gifting zone? It's such a joy. I’ve got to say, throughout all of it, you're such an even keel, optimistic, always above the fray, hopeful. You always look for the best and I so admire that in you. I’m scrappier. I’m like, “If I could be as gracious as you.”
That's too kind. I would flip it and say the same to you. You bring the best out of me, Tracey.
Price Of Leadership: Leadership is about influence, which means we can all be leaders, and we all need to develop that leadership skill in some form or fashion.
Thanks, Phil. I appreciate that. Is there anything else that you would like to leave for our leaders? While we have the floor with them, is there anything else you want to say or some leadership nuggets you want to share with them?
Be faithful in your personal life and your professional life. There are times where you want to go, “Enough.” I've often said faithfulness is waking up, getting up, and going in to do it again the next day. Eugene Peterson said, “Faithfulness is the long obedience in the same direction.” My encouragement, not knowing where people are at in their leadership experience and what they're experiencing now is to just be faithful.
Those are real words. It's persistence, relentlessness, and the victor’s won but it isn’t over yet so you’ve got to suit up and keep on going. Thank you for that, Phil. I appreciate that. How can people find out about you and your tremendous organization? If they have kids in the area or want to learn more about it or might consider moving to South Central, PA, because this exists, how do they reach out and find you?
They can reach out to me at PhilPuleo@CSAGH.org. We'd love to hear from you, encourage you, and share more about our school and its mission. Thanks, Tracey, for the opportunity.
You’re welcome. I can't thank you enough for the insights. I scroll down quite a few notes and you're always such an encouragement to me. I'm glad you've been a staple in my life since I came back. I’m thankful for that. Congratulations on the school year and showing up and making it happen. I'm proud of you and I'm sure the kids are loving it and being back to school. Who thought they'd be happy to go back to school?
They are thrilled. They are back in school, they are loving the community, loving the education. For those who can't, we have offered them a flexible learning option where they keep their same teacher, the same group of friends, and stay on the same course in their curriculum. Our people are ecstatic to be back.
I can see the enthusiasm. I know you were leading up to this and I'm so glad. Let's get it going and you found a way to do it. To our readers out there, if you liked what you read, please be sure to reach out to Phil. Like him on Facebook, find out more about his school. Subscribe to this channel and share it. Do us the honor of a five-star rating. We would be so thankful. To our tremendous leaders out there, thank you for reading for your desire to be developed and for reading what it takes to pay the price of leadership. Have a tremendous rest of the day.
Important Links:
Facebook – Christian School Association of Greater Harrisburg